In Steven Soderbergh's new movie The Informant!, Matt Damon plays Mark Whitacre, a bio-chemist at Archer Daniels Midland (ADM) who sets off an investigation by the Federal Bureau of Investigation into allegations of price-fixing at the agricultural industry giant. Whitacre suffers from delusions of grandeur (among other things) and is all too eager to make the feds' case by recording insider conversations. He imagines that when it's all over, his grateful bosses will promote him to the top of ADM. The movie is based on a true story, in which local FBI agent Bob Herndon is played by actor Joel McHale (most recognizable as the host of E!'s "The Soup").
After the jump, nine questions with Special Agent Herndon, a 23-year veteran of the FBI who works in the FBI's Kansas City Division. Warning: spoilers ahead!
Plog: How did the case with Mark Whitacre stack up against
other cases in your career? Was it the biggest? The most
time-consuming? The most embarrassing?
Herndon:
I've been fortunate to have some pretty good investigations that I've been a part of. There was the Robert
Courtney investigation that got national attention, about a local pharmacist who was diluting cancer drugs. I had another case on a federal judge
in New Orleans who took bribes from a drug dealer; he was the first federal judge ever convicted of
bribery. I worked undercover for three years
in D.C. So the ADM case was a huge case, and very time consuming. I spent five years on that case, but it was unique in its own
way. The movie really emphasized some of the craziness that we saw spread
out over five years, but in the movie it's spread out over 100 minutes, so it looks really crazy.
P: How frustrating was it to see your case dissolving because of Whitacre?
H: It was extremely frustrating. It was something that caused a lot of
arguments between the FBI case agents and prosecutors. It seemed some of
our greatest fights were internal as we tried to resolve and work around the latest shenanigans pulled off by Mark Whitacre. The trial (against ADM)
went for about four months in Chicago, and in the end (in 1998), when the jury came
back with all guilty verdicts, it was probably the most emotional I've ever
been during my professional career. It was as if the jury was affirming that the things my
partner and I had done were right. We got so attacked by (ADM's) defense attorneys over
Mark Whitacre, as if we'd allowed him to do those things, they made it seem
as though we'd told him to do those things. I think, as you recognize, you can't
control a human being unless you're with him 24-7. So when jury heard and saw
everything, they made the criminals pay for their actions and affirmed that what the
two FBI agents did was correct.
P: Did you get to take a break after that whole ordeal was over?
H: Right before the trial started, I'd received a transfer back home to
KC, so during the trial my family moved (from Springfield, Illinois) back home to KC and as soon as
trial was over, I packed up and moved back to KC myself. I took
two weeks off before reporting to the office. I cut the grass, moved
into our new home, and one day while I was cutting the grass, my wife
came out with the phone and said, "Hey, the director of the FBI is on the phone for you." I'm like, "No, it's not." But yes, it was Louis Freeh, the director at the time, calling just to congratulate me on
our work and the outcome. He knew all the issues we'd had with Whitacre, so that
was a good call to get while I was on vacation.
P: Did you blame yourself for not realizing sooner that Whitacre was not telling the complete truth?
H: Typically, with a cooperating witness, our investigation is not on that
person. The reason they know about criminal activity is that they participated
too, so what we do is work with them to make tape recordings of the criminal activity, and make all our focus on the complaint that they're making. Our very first tape from Mark, they're talking about
fixing prices. So we had a very good comfort level with the first tape. We knew Mark was shooting straight on this one
topic. In this case, hindsight is
always 20/20, there came a point where we're thinking, "Wow, maybe we should start
to investigate these cooperators." I'm a different agent now, I ask different questions of our cooperators based on the ADM experience. Sometimes I'm more demanding of my
cooperators. We're always learning. Even at 23 years on the job, I'm
learning new tricks, new ideas, new things to do.
P: Do you think anything in this movie will discourage people from becoming whistle-blowers?
H: I'm hoping that people who see this will see that the two agents, especially my
character, stuck with (Whitacre). In the next-to-last scene in the movie, I'm visiting
him in prison, supporting his pardon request. I'm hoping people take that
message home: "If I'm doing wrong, there is someone I can turn to that won't
abandon me." We recognize that people
make mistakes, and we're in the mistake business, and we can help people who
find themselves in the same situation as Mark Whitacre. Rarely do you see one as out of control
as Mark Whitacre. That's why they made a movie, he's kind of an extreme example. Typically, we just have people come
in who have made mistakes and want to get their life back to normal, and we give them a way to
get back to normal.
P: Did you have any trepidation about being portrayed in a movie?
H: Oh yeah. (laughs) I didn't have any input in making the movie. Director Soderbergh didn't want his actors to meet the real-life people. But when they were almost done filming, they invited my family out to L. A. last summer to watch a day of
filming. It was just us, Joel McHale, Matt Damon and Scott Bakula, all alone, talking about
things. It felt comfortable.
P: Did Joel McHale do a good job playing you?
H: I thought he did a great job
playing me. We text back and forth every so often. My mom, when she saw the
trailer, she thought it was me in the trailer. I told that to Joel, and he said, "I love your
mom." When we went to the set, Joel was wearing his gun on his right side, so I told him, "I shoot left-handed," and he said, "Actually, so do I." But it's funny, that's only something
a geeky FBI agent would pay attention to.
P: What was the FBI's role in the making of the film? Did they cooperate at all? Do they approve?
H: There was no cooperation, no technical assistance provided. For the book, The Informant, the FBI
approved myself and a few others to speak with (author) Kurt Eichenwald. So I spent a lot of
time with him while he was writing the book, answering questions and describing scenes.
Lots of agents and prosecutors helped. When Steven Soderbergh purchased the rights to the
book, we learned there could be a movie made. We all
thought it would be your typical, case-oriented FBI film, maybe a thriller.
much of the script was lifted directly from the transcripts. I thought it was good in the sense of sending
a message to people about greed and lack of ethics, not only on a corporate
level but on an individual level.
I thought Joel did a great job
playing a character he doesn't get to play often.
When I came home Thursday night, I texted Joel to say, "Great job." He texted back right away saying, "Bob, it's
my honor to play someone so cool." I texted back, "Joel stop the sarcasm." He's just a funny, good-hearted guy. Recently I went to Seattle, which is his
hometown, and I asked him where he would recommend to go for lunch. He texted his recommendations and then said, "Bob, do you have time
to go meet my parents? My parents would love to meet you." How many
Hollywood types do you expect to say, Hey, I want you to meet my mom and
dad? That tells you a lot right there.
The Informant! opens Friday, September 18th.
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